I was just curious about this. Many say Manny was 1 dimensional in the fight vs Marquez. Though ok, what else could he have done? Counter punch as well? That would be quite a boring match. In that case, what do you do to someone that doesn't punch unless you punch (aka *******)? What if Marquez and lets say Barrera went at it. Who would you choose as the winner? I also think Manny's plan to beat Marquez by just using all out power was the best way to beat a counter puncher had it worked. I dunno what else he could have done.

try swarming him - there'll be too many shots to counter!

i agree, just keep the pressure on. they cant counter everything.

Pacquiao-Barrera was the blueprint. Remember that MAB is an excellent counterpuncher as well, but it was obvious that Pac's blurring combos were giving him some problems. The whole fussilade. I remember Freddie Roach urging Pac to throw combinations in the middle rounds vs. JMM, but he never did.

Volume punching, i guess.

Quick 1-2 combos, just like rd.9 Johnson-RJones Jr., rd.3 Pacquiao-Barrera, rd.1 Pacquiao-JMMarquez

You get a good pair of socks.

Increase the volume of punches from many angles usually works very well. Most counterpunchers need a lil time to gauge timming of one particualr shot.

swarming him would prolly be the best
but if your good at countering yourself
then you might want to try to make him be aggressiv there by taken him out of his game plan

and if all else fails
Punch him in the nutz

swarming him would prolly be the best
but if your good at countering yourself
then you might want to try to make him be aggressiv there by taken him out of his game plan

and if all else fails
Punch him in the nutz
LMFAO!! i been boxing and boxing but just the other day i got hit by a low blow for the 1st time, it ****in hurts :eek:

For real...I haven't been seriously hit in the nuts in about 3 years until about a week ago when I was drunk with my buddies and one of my friends threw a football that I wasn't expecting and it hit me flush. I was down for the count for about 15 minutes.

To answer the question I think swarmers do well against counter punchers. I guess anyone with a good chin and high work rate would do well against them...or someone who fights well inside and can smother their opponents punches. Picking your spots and making them count also helps.

swarming him would prolly be the best
but if your good at countering yourself
then you might want to try to make him be aggressiv there by taken him out of his game plan

and if all else fails
Punch him in the nutzFunny, but it's an effective, legitimate dirty tactic. I for one have used it on several of my sparring sessions when I'm being outgunned or just plain tired and have to slow the guy down in front of me, of course I pretend that it was just an accident(lol). But yeah going back to the question.... I for one have been fortunate in my boxing experience to have faced natural counter-punchers, and these type of fighters pose a very difficult challenge cause natural counter-punchers tend to be the ones who are naturally gifted athletically, I mean if there's an opportunity to land a punch, you've gotta capitalize on it quick cause that "window of opportunity" closes real quick with these type of fighters. A perfect example would be the Pac - Marquez fight, that's why Pacquaio turned into a 1punch at a time fighter and man when I was watching the Pac - JMM fight I could totally relate to the difficulty Pac was having with Marquez's counterpunching. But yeah one of the most effective ways to really offset counterpunchers is to throw combos and jab, jab, jab. Depending on who your fighting sometimes these guys have been so comfortable just being a counter-puncher that they get thrown off when their opponent gives them their own medicine, as in the Marco Antonio Barrera vs. " Prince" Naseem Hamed.

use alot of faints and get the other fighter to commit, and then catch him.....or smother him and make it a brawl....

If the opponenet likes bein the agresor attack, if like to counter wait for hom and counter him.

The Jab is what beats a counter puncher. See leonard vs. Benitez.

Yeh, everyone has been correct so far. I'm just gonna throw my two cents in for the hell of it.

You've gotta roll your shoulders and feint, change distance constantly, and only throw punches when you're within range. Feint on the outside, fight on the inside. Put a quick jab in his face from underneath and then start throwing punches. Don't worry too much about where they land or how hard they are, just throw them. That was how Rocky Marciano beat Jersey Joe Walcott. He threw punches at his elbows, on his shoulders, wherever there was an opening. The accumulation of all that punishment slowed Walcott down considerably, so that at the end Marciano was faster than him.

The last thing you want to do is fight on the outside. The distance allows them to see better, and they're freer to move as they please. You have to take those advantages away. And don't ever paw with your jab from the outside, especially not against a counterpuncher. A lotta guys say it distracts them, but really it just opens you up like a can of beans.

If you up the movements of your body and feet it will throw off some counterpunchers. He just wont know how you'll attack and where to place his counters. He cannot think. That's opens him up. Throw in some feints and then you got him really ****ed.

try swarming him - there'll be too many shots to counter!

like Glen Johnson did Roy

Tell Manny to learn how to box,show him some tapes of Julio Cesar Chavez. Marquez is not only the best counter puncher but the best boxer Manny will ever have the privilege to fight. Manny doesnt have half the skill JCC had so forget beating Marquez or any real BOXER ever again cause he got exposed! If u see their fight again Marquez would jab and throw rights.You make it seem like he was just waiting for a punch to come flying at him which was only his hurt :confused: left hand and counter. I saw very different and Manny does have a punchers chance but not the talent buddy.

Make Marquez have to come to him. A taller opponent with a jab could do this better. He would have no choice but to come foward or be dominated from behind the jab. Anyone see JMM last fight? Thats one dimentional. He was really uncomfortable when his opponent wouldn't come to him. Its not hard to frustrate Marquez, winning though is a different matter. On paper Mannys style is made for him.

Tell Manny to learn how to box,show him some tapes of Julio Cesar Chavez. Marquez is not only the best counter puncher but the best boxer Manny will ever have the privilege to fight. Manny doesnt have half the skill JCC had so forget beating Marquez or any real BOXER ever again cause he got exposed! If u see their fight again Marquez would jab and throw rights.You make it seem like he was just waiting for a punch to come flying at him which was only his hurt :confused: left hand and counter. I saw very different and Manny does have a punchers chance but not the talent buddy.I've posted these before, but anyway in response to your statement " That Marquez is the best counter-puncher/boxer Pac has faced" I somewhat agree, I would rate Marquez second to Sasakul of Thailand as the best counter-puncher/ boxer Pac has ever faced even though Pac knocked him the f**k out As far as Manny being exposed in the JMM fight, I don't think Manny was exposed, that has been Pacquaio the whole time, One big left and that's it, in all his fights.

Yeah, I agree with the feinting part. If you can feint very will after landing a consistent jab you can time how they will respond or counter to your punches...and you gotta have good head movement...if not, good footwork...to get in and out.

Tell Manny to learn how to box,show him some tapes of Julio Cesar Chavez. Marquez is not only the best counter puncher but the best boxer Manny will ever have the privilege to fight. Manny doesnt have half the skill JCC had so forget beating Marquez or any real BOXER ever again cause he got exposed! If u see their fight again Marquez would jab and throw rights.You make it seem like he was just waiting for a punch to come flying at him which was only his hurt :confused: left hand and counter. I saw very different and Manny does have a punchers chance but not the talent buddy.

On the contrary, it looks to me that it was JMM who got exposed. First knockdown, he tasted the power of Pacman's left. Second KD it is still the same left. Third KD, the same ****in' left. Committing the same mistake three times is stupid.

How do you beat a hugger-puncher like Ruiz?

How do you beat a hugger-puncher like Ruiz?

Throw some good body combinations (like what Pacquiao did to Barrera) or.. counter punch him if he tries to hug you.

Tell Manny to learn how to box,show him some tapes of Julio Cesar Chavez. Marquez is not only the best counter puncher but the best boxer Manny will ever have the privilege to fight. Manny doesnt have half the skill JCC had so forget beating Marquez or any real BOXER ever again cause he got exposed! If u see their fight again Marquez would jab and throw rights.You make it seem like he was just waiting for a punch to come flying at him which was only his hurt :confused: left hand and counter. I saw very different and Manny does have a punchers chance but not the talent buddy.

Pac raped Barrera in his backyard. How the **** can you say he don't got talent. You know nothing....

Throw some good body combinations (like what Pacquiao did to Barrera) or.. counter punch him if he tries to hug you. Alot easier said than done though, I mean we would've seen it already w/ all the fighters Ruiz has faced, but yeah it's probably the best strategy like you said, punch before Ruiz even grabs a hold of you, or do a lot of side to side movement and punch from different angles ex. Roy Jones Jr. vs. John Ruiz. Going back to what strategy is effective when a fighter likes to clinch. Me and my trainer would actually work on ways so we wouldn't end up getting tied up and the thing with clinching is, it's kinda sneaky, its almost like the punch you didn't see, next thing you know you are tied up and wrestling w/ your opponent wasting energy trying to get yourself out of it. One counter that is pretty much my bread and butter when I sense that my opponent is about to tie me up, is shoot a straight punch right down the middle to his solar plexus and follow it up or after the shot, or pivot and throw some more shots. Another example of a fight where one fighter was using the punch and grab tactic was the first Tszyu - Mitchell fight and as some of you saw, Kostya was just roughin' him up on the inside everytime Mitchell would grab, I mean sometimes getting dirty is o.k. like throwing some inside elbows(kinda like throwing a short uppercut, but the elbow lands on the chest or midsection, Tyson is a good example of this, or watch some Muay Thai kickboxing and see how those guys execute it) and make them eat some shoulder as well, when in a tie-up, any of you remember that 1st Roy Jones Jr. fight with Montell Griffin, remember that round where Jones Jr. and Griffin were in a clinch and Montell just gave Roy some shoulder right on RJJ'S chin and Roy got backed up from it and Montell followed it up w/ an overhand or straight punch. I remember watching that fight and saw that particular strategy and I was just so proud of myself cause at that time, that was when i was just a gym rat and my trainer would show us and work on little "slightly" dirty, crafty moves and seeing it getting executed by a pro, I thought that was just cool, since there were times that I would be skeptical and didn't see the "big" picture on what he was preaching and showing us and what felt like torture on some of those brutal workout sessions.

Pressure, good chin and power!

Jones Jr. and Holyfield showed the way to beat Ruiz- in Evander's case-throw lots of shots in the inside, counterpunch, and throw the uppercut. In Jones's case, use footmovement and get Ruiz off his gameplan. A large reason for Ruiz's success is that he hasn't faced opponents with good handspeed-he's been able to beat guys to the punch and then grapple. Someone who can outspeed him like Toney or Byrd would beat him . . .

Pac raped Barrera in his backyard. How the **** can you say he don't got talent. You know nothing.... Or maybe it's the other way around that JMM, MORALES, and Barrera aren't as good as they're made out to be, therefore a tough, sloppy fighter like Pac is able to compete w/ 2 out of the three.

Or maybe it's the other way around that JMM, MORALES, and Barrera aren't as good as they're made out to be, therefore a tough, sloppy fighter like Pac is able to compete w/ 2 out of the three.

I think MAB has done enough in his career to have his talent unquestioned. He was alone to have disposed of Prince and gave Morales absolute war. No, he is good and people shouldn't doubt his capabilities. Pac is way tooo underrated. The kid shows more technique, body movements and ring generalship than most brawlers. I wouldn't call him sloppy or wild like Mayorga. Hey if his punches are connecting, you gotta give him SOMETHING. If he was a sloppy or technique lacking as you say he is, MAB would have been the gatekeeper that filtered him out.

On the contrary, it looks to me that it was JMM who got exposed. First knockdown, he tasted the power of Pacman's left. Second KD it is still the same left. Third KD, the same ****in' left. Committing the same mistake three times is stupid.

WELL PEOPLE ONLY HAVE ONE LEFT HAND, AND THE WAY JMM FOUGHT AFTER THE FIRST ROUND TELLS THAT HE WAS JUST SURPRISED IN THE FIRST. TELL ME IF ANYONE ELSE WOULD OF GOTTEN UP AND SCHOOLED MANNY LIKE MARQUEZ, HE IS A VERY INTELLEGENT BOXER. IN NO WAY IS HE STUPID. THE REMATCH WILL PROVE MANY THINGS THAT I HAVE SAID.

WELL PEOPLE ONLY HAVE ONE LEFT HAND, AND THE WAY JMM FOUGHT AFTER THE FIRST ROUND TELLS THAT HE WAS JUST SURPRISED IN THE FIRST. TELL ME IF ANYONE ELSE WOULD OF GOTTEN UP AND SCHOOLED MANNY LIKE MARQUEZ, HE IS A VERY INTELLEGENT BOXER. IN NO WAY IS HE STUPID. THE REMATCH WILL PROVE MANY THINGS THAT I HAVE SAID.

LOL You're so sure of Marquez in the rematch I'd hate to see you get disappointed in Feb.

u need 2 work behind a good jab

For real...I haven't been seriously hit in the nuts in about 3 years until about a week ago when I was drunk with my buddies and one of my friends threw a football that I wasn't expecting and it hit me flush. I was down for the count for about 15 minutes.

To answer the question I think swarmers do well against counter punchers. I guess anyone with a good chin and high work rate would do well against them...or someone who fights well inside and can smother their opponents punches. Picking your spots and making them count also helps.

just today i sparred with my friend first round we went slugging and i would win the exchange but when he started to counter punch i couldn't do anything but thing that worked the best was at least 3 - 4 punch combinations all straights. since the counter puncher looks for an opening after a punch he can't do it when there are so many swarming him . :boxing:

alot of feints

Mix up your jabs and feints, throw combinations. Let them lead(for example: MAB vs Naz).

I was just reading this thread, and thinking "dammmn these guys really know their ****. This board isnt solely filled with fanboys and then i looked at the date and saw that this thread is 5years old" were are all these posters at?

I was just curious about this. Many say Manny was 1 dimensional in the fight vs Marquez. Though ok, what else could he have done? Counter punch as well? That would be quite a boring match. In that case, what do you do to someone that doesn't punch unless you punch (aka *******)? What if Marquez and lets say Barrera went at it. Who would you choose as the winner? I also think Manny's plan to beat Marquez by just using all out power was the best way to beat a counter puncher had it worked. I dunno what else he could have done.

punch him harder than he punches you

I was just reading this thread, and thinking "dammmn these guys really know their ****. This board isnt solely filled with fanboys and then i looked at the date and saw that this thread is 5years old" were are all these posters at?Which posts did you like?

Feints are the way to beat a counter puncher.....

LMFAO!! i been boxing and boxing but just the other day i got hit by a low blow for the 1st time, it ****in hurts :eek:

get a protective cup from a sports shop!

have incredibly long arms like p williams and just throw one jab at a time and dance lol

I think Elpacman seeing the growth in Pac now will or should admit that Pac was one demeinsonal in that fight. That was easy to see

Slickness agressiviness

Nice thread. Just taking some notes for next time I spar with a counter puncher :)

Throw one punch at a time then either move out the way or move inside. Or volume punch.

i agree, just keep the pressure on. they cant counter everything.

Pressure and cutting distance. From what I've seen, great counter punchers are great at using distance to get maximum power and speed on their punches. Once the distance is there, timing will allow them to tag a guy at will but without the space to work, they are taken out of their game and forced to grind it out.

two different(most effective) ways:


box them from a distance, potshotting.
smother them at close range.

to outcounterpunch a counter puncher, make them bite on fake counter opportunities by using feints or half assed easy to restract punches to lure their fire, and then counter their counters.

Feints and accuracy. Its hard to counter when youre getting hit consistently.

You don't miss when you lead and be ready for the counter to counter back. You start and end the exchanges, stick and move and beat them to the punch.

two different(most effective) ways:


box them from a distance, potshotting.
smother them at close range.

to outcounterpunch a counter puncher, make them bite on fake counter opportunities by using feints or half assed easy to restract punches to lure their fire, and then counter their counters.

Much like with what Judah did to Mayweather, he'd fake a jab, Floyd would quickly react, and before you knew it Mayweather was eating Judah's straight left hand.

Much like with what Judah did to Mayweather, he'd fake a jab, Floyd would quickly react, and before you knew it Mayweather was eating Judah's straight left had.
exactly.

which is why Mayweather decided it was more effective to simply erase Judahs countering with a high guard and pressure.
which was a smart move.

mix it up, dont fight predictably, fight inside, outside, switch up your lead hand, stagger your punches, go high and low, use volume, be defensive.

pretty much don't do the same thing for more than about 30 seconds, just keep changing and confuse them

You can force them to take the lead which can make them very uncomfortable, kind of what Jimmy Young did to Ali or Mayweather did to Marquez (but this can only be effective if you are an excellent technician). Or you can swarm them, take away their jab like what Vazquez did to Marquez or what Tyson and Frazier did to their opponents (not sure if this would work with JMM). Also, lots of feints can definitely frustrate counterpunchers since that makes them over commit and you can then counterpunch them. Or try to get inside and rough them up, like what Roberto Duran and Andre Ward does.

You can force them to take the lead which can make them very uncomfortable, kind of what Jimmy Young did to Ali or Mayweather did to Marquez (but this can only be effective if you are an excellent technician). Or you can swarm them, take away their jab like what Vazquez did to Marquez or what Tyson and Frazier did to their opponents (not sure if this would work with JMM). Also, lots of feints can definitely frustrate counterpunchers since that makes them over commit and you can then counterpunch them. Or try to get inside and rough them up, like what Roberto Duran and Andre Ward does.

I forgot about that, Young got robbed in that fight, Ali was clueless as to what to do

You gotta walk him down and beat his ass.

Punching first and last.....