View Full Version : Championship fights: 15 rounds to 12 rounds


BoxingPromoter
11-07-2004, 07:17 PM
I assume that in the 1980s the boxing coucils IBF,WBA changed

the format of championship fights from 15 to 12 rounds. when and

why exactly did they make this change? Was it the boxing councils

who changed it or some other governing body?

BoxingPromoter
11-09-2004, 06:32 PM
Why won't any of you boxing history reply to my post? I'm curious

to hear anyone's insights or opinions. I wish heavyweight fights

or any weight class for that matter, went 15 rounds. It really

separated the men from the boys.

No-Mas
11-09-2004, 06:43 PM
It had to do with the Mancini / Kim fight. The thought was that serious damage was done to fighters in the later rounds, so all the alphabet groups switched to 12 round championship fights. Some switched quicker than others, but they all changed due to the big outcry over the Mancini / Kim fight.

loangunZ
11-09-2004, 09:34 PM
I use to like the fights that didn't end until someone when down for the count for good

tntkid
11-09-2004, 11:25 PM
The Mancini / Kim fight was a brutal slugfest

TysonForeman
11-09-2004, 11:41 PM
I use to like the fights that didn't end until someone when down for the count for good
Didn't they stop doing Finish Fights in like, 1910?

loangunZ
11-10-2004, 12:55 AM
haha yea but the idea was still pretty cool

BoxingPromoter
11-14-2004, 01:59 PM
It had to do with the Mancini / Kim fight. The thought was that serious damage was done to fighters in the later rounds, so all the alphabet groups switched to 12 round championship fights. Some switched quicker than others, but they all changed due to the big outcry over the Mancini / Kim fight.

Thank you for the reply,No Mas, but I still think championship

fights would be more entertaining and decisive if they went 15.

Silencer
11-19-2004, 12:56 AM
Twelve rounds for me is the ideal no of rounds...

BoxingPromoter
11-21-2004, 12:37 PM
Twelve rounds for me is the ideal no of rounds...

why not 15 rounds, explain your answer?

Cletus Funk
11-22-2004, 12:17 PM
why not 15 rounds, explain your answer?


I think 12 lets them set a faster pace which makes for a more interesting fight.

Argentina
11-22-2004, 10:41 PM
I assume that in the 1980s the boxing coucils IBF,WBA changed

the format of championship fights from 15 to 12 rounds. when and

why exactly did they make this change? Was it the boxing councils

who changed it or some other governing body?

I believe that modern eraa fighters retire with much less brain damage and can speak much better than those fighters that constantly went at it for 15 rounds. I fully support the 12 round system, fifteen rounds is wayy too excessive.

Ivansmamma
11-23-2004, 05:56 AM
12 rounds is enough.

BoxingPromoter
11-23-2004, 11:16 AM
I believe that modern eraa fighters retire with much less brain damage and can speak much better than those fighters that constantly went at it for 15 rounds. I fully support the 12 round system, fifteen rounds is wayy too excessive.

From a boxer's point of view, you could make a strong argument
against fighting 15 rounds. Just take a look at Muhammad Ali's fight record and you will see that alot of his fights went the distance or ended in later round ko's. Had these fights ended in 12 rounds, Ali might not have been so brain damaged.

From a fan's point of view, you want to see long hard fought fights where the winner is determined by who could outlast their opponent.(Thrilla in Manilla) But on the other hand, who wants to see a brain damaged fighter like Ali suffer so much with the disability. I would have loved to see Ali call fights on HBO and give insight on an ESPN show. Its a wonder George Foreman still has all his marbles after all the punishment he has taken in the ring. :mad:

leff
11-23-2004, 11:32 AM
I box as an amature, i train 12-15 hours a week, and im just too 4times2 min, and thats so i want to vommit in the second.

15 times 3 isent healhty, and todays heavys are to heavy.

jayschre
11-24-2004, 04:40 AM
15 Rd. fights would have probably ended boxing in the U.S. for good, if they hadn't changed to 12 rds. IMO alot more fighters would have died as result of trauma sustained in a fight. Can you imagine what Meldrick Taylor would have been like if he had fought three more rds. against Chavez I mean damn he was never the same anyways, But I think he would have been brain dead after another 9 minutes of that war.

No-Mas
11-24-2004, 07:19 PM
Along with the Mancini/Kim tragedy, there is another reason why fights went from fifteen to twelve.

What controls all sports? Answer: TV networks.

The TV networks back then were showing tons of fights. CBS had CBS Sports Spectacular, NBC had SportsWorld, ABC had Wide World of Sports and all featured boxing. Fifteen round fights went over an hour while twelve round fights fit perfectly into an hour block (48 minutes of fight time leaves plenty of time for build-up and post-fight interviews). A twelve rounder is tailor made to fit into an hour of TV.

The Mancini/Kim tragedy started the ball rolling, but the networks readily agreed (probably pushed) to twelve round fights that would fit into their schedules more easily. Look what the networks do to the NFL. They push the league to get the games to move quicker (45 to 40 second play clock) so the games can fit nice and tidy into a three hour block. The NFL gets the biggest sports rating for the networks and the networks still want it trimmed to a nice neat three hour package. They did the same to boxing back in the eighties.

jayschre
11-25-2004, 06:12 AM
I also heard that the kim duk vs. mancini fight left more than kim dead as his wife I think it was committed suicide as well as the ref of the fight! That's some pretty f'd up stuff to deal with, I'm not suprised after hearing that info that boom boom was never really the same!

blackbelt2003
11-26-2004, 11:33 AM
I think 15 rounds for WBC, WBA and IBF titles should be allowed. A lot of boxing history would be different had it been 12 rounds from the beginning.

And some of todays' greats might not have been so great if today's fights were 15 rounds.


Black

BoxingPromoter
11-26-2004, 05:20 PM
I think 15 rounds for WBC, WBA and IBF titles should be allowed. A lot of boxing history would be different had it been 12 rounds from the beginning.

And some of todays' greats might not have been so great if today's fights were 15 rounds.


Black

Muhammad Ali was truly the king of 15 roundas(im from boston) and because of that he is now permately brain damaged. Ali fought wars with frasier,norton,shavers,spinks,etc. Ali was the wittiest boxer and maybe sports hero in history, I just wish he didn't take all that punishment in the last half of his career.Just imagine him calling boxing matches next to george foreman, the insight he could have provided.

I think it was a good idea to change the format, to protect the fighters. :mad:

blackbelt2003
11-26-2004, 05:22 PM
There've been plenty of injuries since 12 rounders came on, too.

It's quite probable Ali would have got damaged fighting in 12 rounders.

Does anyone have any evidence BTW that says whether injury has been decreased since 15 rounders were abolished? I'd be interested to see it.

Black

paulmmv
11-27-2004, 11:05 PM
it was the mancini vs kim fight right after that accident the boxing council changed the champion ship rounds from 15 to 12

BigMikeD
11-28-2004, 10:34 PM
Ithink thats to long

BigMikeD
11-28-2004, 10:35 PM
they cant last 5

BigMikeD
11-28-2004, 10:35 PM
12 rounds is fine

Dynamite76
11-29-2004, 03:12 PM
I know the WBA and the IBF changed in the mid to late 80s, but the WBC initiated the change in '82 and started using it around '83. This was due primarily to the Mancini-Kim fight, but also adding fuel to the fire was the Pryor-Arguello match and the Holmes-Cobb match, which caused Cosell to turn his back on boxing.

plexmc
11-30-2004, 06:43 PM
I assume that in the 1980s the boxing coucils IBF,WBA changed

the format of championship fights from 15 to 12 rounds. when and

why exactly did they make this change? Was it the boxing councils

who changed it or some other governing body?
I feel u on that

plexmc
11-30-2004, 06:44 PM
I know the WBA and the IBF changed in the mid to late 80s, but the WBC initiated the change in '82 and started using it around '83. This was due primarily to the Mancini-Kim fight, but also adding fuel to the fire was the Pryor-Arguello match and the Holmes-Cobb match, which caused Cosell to turn his back on boxing.
I feel u on that

Mr. Violence
12-06-2004, 02:20 AM
it had to do with ring deaths. there was a number of ring deaths in the 80's and the commissions agreed to change it to 12 rounds because of this fact.

Hunna
12-06-2004, 05:23 AM
world class boxers put their health on the line, in 12 round bouts, even more in the old 15 rounders. I spose thats the price the pay for fame and fortune, life is never easy and nothing comes for free. I say let the people and consumers decide! ;)

Great
12-06-2004, 05:29 PM
12 is good.

leff
12-06-2004, 06:28 PM
12 is good.

Yes 12 is good but 15 is great.

Colonel Jones
12-06-2004, 08:38 PM
I think it depends on what you remember growing up that influences your choice of rounds. I remember 15 round fights and it seemed to me that it didn't put the guy who liked to start slower at a bigger disadvantage as it does today. I feel like there would be less controversial decisions as well. THose extra 3 rounds really did seperate the men from boys at times. But maybe the trade off of fighter safety was worth it. If it really is safer.

Dynamite76
12-07-2004, 10:16 PM
I know that I miss the 15 round title fight and in some cases, it could be used today, like possibly unification matches.

sssse
12-11-2004, 05:34 PM
[QUOTE=Silencer]Twelve rounds for me is the ideal no of rounds...[/QUOTE
I agree.

BodysnatcherFan
12-12-2004, 10:59 AM
12 runds is better coz they have to conserve enrgy to go 15 rounds so this has better action.

BodysnatcherFan
12-12-2004, 10:59 AM
Fighters will get tired in 15 rounds 12 is better.

tri4ben2
12-12-2004, 11:28 AM
I am in favor of shortening the fights even more. IF fighters were pacing themselves for 8 rounds in stead of 12, I think fighters would take more risks.

Maybe it can be a situation like K2 where if after a certain number of rounds, the judgess can decide if they want more.

BodysnatcherFan
12-12-2004, 11:49 AM
I am in favor of shortening the fights even more. IF fighters were pacing themselves for 8 rounds in stead of 12, I think fighters would take more risks.

Maybe it can be a situation like K2 where if after a certain number of rounds, the judgess can decide if they want more.
I agree with you. I hate seeing clinching BS, why fights 12 runds just make it 8 or 10, quality beats quantity.

bill1234
03-04-2007, 11:54 AM
Fighters will get tired in 15 rounds 12 is better.

Thats because they don't train. 15 rounds will create more action because they have to train a lot harder. And it will sort out the crappy people form the bad people. There isn't one heavyweight out there right now that could compete in the 80's on back.

K-DOGG
03-04-2007, 12:18 PM
My two cents: ALL WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP FIGHTS SHOULD BE 15 ROUNDS.


The World Championship should be something special.....which brings up the topic of banning all governing bodies; but that's another thread.

bill1234
03-04-2007, 12:29 PM
My two cents: ALL WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP FIGHTS SHOULD BE 15 ROUNDS.


The World Championship should be something special.....which brings up the topic of banning all governing bodies; but that's another thread.

I agree 1000%.

American_Ninja
03-04-2007, 02:05 PM
15 Rd. fights would have probably ended boxing in the U.S. for good, if they hadn't changed to 12 rds. IMO alot more fighters would have died as result of trauma sustained in a fight. Can you imagine what Meldrick Taylor would have been like if he had fought three more rds. against Chavez I mean damn he was never the same anyways, But I think he would have been brain dead after another 9 minutes of that war.

Taylor wouldn't have gone 3 more rounds. He had taken heavy shots thru out the fight. He was busted up and bleeding, eyes swelled up. Chavez
may have been out boxed, but he was landing the harder shots.

Changing fights from 15 to 12 hasn't stopped fighters from dieing.
Boxing is a violent sport. Bowe never fought a 15 round fight, his speech is slurred. Duran fought in 15 rounders, he is ok. I don't think it has ever been proven that Ali's Parkinson's was caused by boxing.

12 round fights are like flies, they are every where. Elimination fights are 12 rounds. Most big non-title fights are 12 rounds. 12 rounds for IBO, WBO
IBA, NABF, etc title fights. The promoters make everything 12 rounds.
Evander Holyfield fought 15 rounds in only his 12th fight. That was a brutal fight. He is the only active fighter today that has been 15 rounds.
How many good fights have ended in draws at 12 rounds? Too many.

I believe that unification fights should be 15 rounds. But I'm old school
what do I know.

K-DOGG
03-04-2007, 03:09 PM
Taylor wouldn't have gone 3 more rounds. He had taken heavy shots thru out the fight. He was busted up and bleeding, eyes swelled up. Chavez
may have been out boxed, but he was landing the harder shots.

Changing fights from 15 to 12 hasn't stopped fighters from dieing.
Boxing is a violent sport. Bowe never fought a 15 round fight, his speech is slurred. Duran fought in 15 rounders, he is ok. I don't think it has ever been proven that Ali's Parkinson's was caused by boxing.

12 round fights are like flies, they are every where. Elimination fights are 12 rounds. Most big non-title fights are 12 rounds. 12 rounds for IBO, WBO
IBA, NABF, etc title fights. The promoters make everything 12 rounds.
Evander Holyfield fought 15 rounds in only his 12th fight. That was a brutal fight. He is the only active fighter today that has been 15 rounds.
How many good fights have ended in draws at 12 rounds? Too many.

I believe that unification fights should be 15 rounds. But I'm old school
what do I know.


Nuthin' wrong with "old school". Glad to meet a classmate. :D

K-DOGG
03-04-2007, 03:10 PM
I agree 1000%.


Ahh, now if we can just convince the rest of the world.

Southpaw Stinger
03-04-2007, 03:33 PM
My two cents: ALL WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP FIGHTS SHOULD BE 15 ROUNDS.


The World Championship should be something special.....which brings up the topic of banning all governing bodies; but that's another thread.

Damn bloody right!

no governing bodies and 15 round world title fights would be glorious.

Dempsey 1919
03-04-2007, 03:34 PM
Ahh, now if we can just convince the rest of the world.

You've got me convinced.:boxing:

K-DOGG
03-04-2007, 03:37 PM
You've got me convinced.:boxing:

Fly, my man, whether you know it or not....you were born "old school". ;)

Southpaw Stinger
03-04-2007, 03:55 PM
Fly, my man, whether you know it or not....you were born "old school". ;)

Do you fancy joining me in creating a super governing body with 15 round title fights and a more old school feel? :headbang:

K-DOGG
03-04-2007, 04:46 PM
Do you fancy joining me in creating a super governing body with 15 round title fights and a more old school feel? :headbang:

I would except for one problem. Should such a body be put together, what's to keep it from being just another problem for the sport in the long range?

Well, let me think on it. I'm all about an "honest" body...if one could be formed; but something must be done to kill the WBC, WBA, WBO, and IBF. Perhapst contracts...hmmmmm. :thinking:


All the rest must burn for the NWO to rule. :firedevil


;)

Southpaw Stinger
03-04-2007, 05:16 PM
I would except for one problem. Should such a body be put together, what's to keep it from being just another problem for the sport in the long range?

Well, let me think on it. I'm all about an "honest" body...if one could be formed; but something must be done to kill the WBC, WBA, WBO, and IBF. Perhapst contracts...hmmmmm. :thinking:


All the rest must burn for the NWO to rule. :firedevil


;)

We could simply buy out all the other sanctioning bodies and then unite them? I'll put some money in a jar every week and save up what i can. I suggest you do the same and we'll see what we can do ;)

Dempsey 1919
03-04-2007, 10:11 PM
We could simply buy out all the other sanctioning bodies and then unite them? I'll put some money in a jar every week and save up what i can. I suggest you do the same and we'll see what we can do ;)

:rofl:.........

Hydro
03-05-2007, 12:19 PM
15 rounds or 12 rounds doesn't bother me that much. Either way is fine with me.

In some of the late stoppages throughout history (Louis-Conn, SRL-Hearns I), I can imagine the guys pacing themselves differently and Leonard being more desperate in say, round 10 of a 12 rounder other than the 13th in a 15 rounder. Same thing with current fights, guys would pace themselves for 15. A case where it would not have mattered I think is Chavez-Taylor I. Taylor just took too much punishment and would've been stopped in the late rounds, IMO.

Fix the weigh-in procedure, that's way more important than the rounds thing.

Southpaw Stinger
03-05-2007, 03:52 PM
15 rounds or 12 rounds doesn't bother me that much. Either way is fine with me.

In some of the late stoppages throughout history (Louis-Conn, SRL-Hearns I), I can imagine the guys pacing themselves differently and Leonard being more desperate in say, round 10 of a 12 rounder other than the 13th in a 15 rounder. Same thing with current fights, guys would pace themselves for 15. A case where it would not have mattered I think is Chavez-Taylor I. Taylor just took too much punishment and would've been stopped in the late rounds, IMO.

Fix the weigh-in procedure, that's way more important than the rounds thing.

yes that thing annoys me a lot.

I was watching Taylor v Ouma last night and it said that at the way in they both scaled below 160 but today Taylor comes at 166 and Ouma at 164 which means that they are really super middles and not genuine middles...

RAESAAD
03-05-2007, 03:59 PM
I think all World title fights should be 13 rounds to lower the risk of a draw.......

Hydro
03-05-2007, 06:36 PM
yes that thing annoys me a lot.

I was watching Taylor v Ouma last night and it said that at the way in they both scaled below 160 but today Taylor comes at 166 and Ouma at 164 which means that they are really super middles and not genuine middles...

Most guys won't enter the ring in their weight class, maybe even in the same day weigh-ins, but they won't be much over the limit.

When a guy like Cotto outweighs his opponent in Corley 157 to 140 on fight night, something is wrong.