View Full Version : If it is true about the brackets already being set....


realkaps
08-14-2003, 11:58 AM
I still wont give Silva any respect if he wins this tournament. If he wins he will have beaten a smaller Saku for the third time, a guy who has no credability in my eyes, and a tired Rampage or Liddell. When will he fight a credible opponent at his weight when they are both fresh? How long is pride going to protect him? I know the guy can fight, but he has never been tested. This is ****ing weak......

Mr. Beelzebub
08-14-2003, 12:01 PM
Rampage also fought a smaller opponent in the first round. YOu never know what might happen.

realkaps
08-14-2003, 12:08 PM
Smaller, yes, but one of the best P4P fighters in the world......

Seraph_17
08-14-2003, 12:14 PM
Well hopefully a tired Liddell or Rampage will still beat Silva, then we won't have to worry about the ethics of Silva winning the whole thing.........

realkaps
08-14-2003, 12:15 PM
Pretty much what I am saying is, I would like to see Silva fight a top ten LHW that is fresh. No smaller guys, no tomato cans, and no guys who just got done fighting a war like I am sure Rampage and Liddell will have.....

Tha Playa
08-14-2003, 01:05 PM
He is getting Yosh for 2 reasons. He is the champ and it's the fight that the japenese people want to see.

purerockfury
08-14-2003, 01:12 PM
the japenese want to see a japense beat silva but tobad they are not going to get it i think silva is going to get cracked by liddell

realkaps
08-14-2003, 01:15 PM
But dont you think that Liddell will be at a disadvantage after fighting Rampage or vice versa?

Curly Howard
08-14-2003, 01:17 PM
I'm sure Silva would like to prove himself. To Pride he's fighting what they think are top ten guys but we all know they're not. I love to watch Silva fight but they gave him an easy path just like I figured they would. Eventually he'll have to fight Jackson or Arona. I can't wait to see it.

realkaps
08-14-2003, 01:20 PM
They'll probably have people from the audiance come and fight him before that happens....

Bluecifer
08-14-2003, 01:51 PM
In my eyes the real GP Champion will be whoever wins between Liddell vs. Jackson. Too bad there's such a pay disparity.

BDWHOAWHOA
08-14-2003, 02:20 PM
We have no idea as to what's going to happen in Nov. Either one of those guys (Liddel/Rampage) could take eachother out in a split second. So we really don't know what's gonna happen. Why don't we just wait til the actual fights to see how it pans out? And personally I don't think Silva shgould even be in the GP. They took a spot away from another contender. And what's the point of winning the GP in the first place? If they had nothing but contenders in there then the winner could fight the champ. So even if Silva does win... big deal!!! He's already the champ, but if he loses then there's a GP champ, but he's not the LHW champ. So what happens then... they have to fight again for the actual belt???

Piedra
08-14-2003, 05:19 PM
Wanderlei is the champion, until any fighter beats him he could have all the advantage pride is giving to him.

Bluecifer
08-14-2003, 05:49 PM
Originally posted by BDWHOAWHOA
We have no idea as to what's going to happen in Nov. Either one of those guys (Liddel/Rampage) could take eachother out in a split second. So we really don't know what's gonna happen. Why don't we just wait til the actual fights to see how it pans out? And personally I don't think Silva shgould even be in the GP. They took a spot away from another contender. And what's the point of winning the GP in the first place? If they had nothing but contenders in there then the winner could fight the champ. So even if Silva does win... big deal!!! He's already the champ, but if he loses then there's a GP champ, but he's not the LHW champ. So what happens then... they have to fight again for the actual belt???

I think this man brings up some interesting points.

Piedra
08-14-2003, 05:54 PM
This is a tournament not a single fight and wanderlei has a lot to do in there, besides sakuraba he is the only one that has participated in a tournament. Due to the safety of fighters this tournament is splited in two events and in 3 fights in just one night.

lightweight
08-14-2003, 06:55 PM
Logically, Silva shouldn't even be in this tournament being the Champ(like BD said), but he's a fighter and felt it his duty to enter. That alone gets my respect, he's got way more to lose then the other fighters. If he wins this tourney it'll still be an amazing accomplishment, but I do agree his path is easier then Rampage/Liddell.

That being said itís not too far off from how a structured bracket would be. A normal bracket would be seeded by rank, fighters are ranked from 1-8 and matched evenly so each match equals a total of 9:
1x8 4x5
3x6 2x7

1.Silva(champ)
2.Rampage
3.Liddell
4.Bustamante
5.Overeem
6.Sakuraba
7.Yoshida
8.Tamura

So it should have been:
Bracket one
Silva vs Tamura
Bustamante vs Overeem

Bracket two
Liddell vs Sakuraba
Rampage vs Yoshida

Liddell and Rampage would have faced each other anyways, but Silva would have faced a bit of a tougher second round in Busta or Overeem. The path is easier for Silva but itís not a stretch.

BDWHOAWHOA
08-14-2003, 08:14 PM
I think that the way they did the bracket was cool. I mean... I agree with LW on the way a bracket is NORMALLY made, but in Pride's case I think they covered all of their tracks.
-Tamura vs Yoshida made sense because it garauntees a Japanese fighter in RD. 2.
-Liddel vs Overeem made sense because of the way they match up (great fight)
-Sak vs Silva because those crazy Japs will pay crazy money to watch one of their superstars get publicly executed.
-And the original fight of Rampage and Arona was great cuz Rampage is ONE OF the ONLY people that can make an exciting fight against Arona's boring ass.

Round 2
-Liddel vs Rampage because otherwise u risk 2 Americans being in the finals (these guys don't have "Don Frye" clout in Japan)
-Silva against any schmuck because they need to make sure he makes it.

And then they're left with no championship superfight when Silva wins it all...

DragonZero
08-14-2003, 09:52 PM
Originally posted by kaps
I still wont give Silva any respect if he wins this tournament. If he wins he will have beaten a smaller Saku for the third time, a guy who has no credability in my eyes, and a tired Rampage or Liddell. When will he fight a credible opponent at his weight when they are both fresh? How long is pride going to protect him? I know the guy can fight, but he has never been tested. This is ****ing weak......




he did get tested by belfort thats why pride is protecting him they don't want that too happen again

realkaps
08-14-2003, 10:31 PM
Tito and Belfort where the only top ten guys he fought they both beat him, Thats been a while though. I know he has the skill, I would just like to see him in some even matchups.....

DragonZero
08-14-2003, 10:33 PM
i'd like too see him fight rampage that would be a test

lightweight
08-15-2003, 06:41 PM
Originally posted by kaps
Tito and Belfort where the only top ten guys he fought they both beat him, Thats been a while though. I know he has the skill, I would just like to see him in some even matchups.....

Back in the day Mike Van Arsdale was the king of NHB, he was considered to be the best NHB fighter at the time(in other words top ten). Silva knocked him out, and he was definitly outweighed in that fight. Arsdale is an Olympic level wrestler, and I think could still do very well in todays scene.

Cro-cop fought Silva as a heavy weight, but at the time wouldn't have been top ten. Not so much because of skill but because he was just starting in MMA, it was still a very dangerous fight for Silva but he took it and drew/won/whatever.

Then his only KO loss to Belfort, and a close decision loss to Tito. I'd consider him 2-2 against top, heavy skilled fighters.

Fallout
08-16-2003, 03:39 PM
Originally posted by lightweight
Back in the day Mike Van Arsdale was the king of NHB, he was considered to be the best NHB fighter at the time(in other words top ten). Silva knocked him out, and he was definitly outweighed in that fight. Arsdale is an Olympic level wrestler, and I think could still do very well in todays scene.

Cro-cop fought Silva as a heavy weight, but at the time wouldn't have been top ten. Not so much because of skill but because he was just starting in MMA, it was still a very dangerous fight for Silva but he took it and drew/won/whatever.

Then his only KO loss to Belfort, and a close decision loss to Tito. I'd consider him 2-2 against top, heavy skilled fighters.

Saying Mike Van Arsdale was a top opponet is a joke. The best people he has beaten are Sakuraba and Dan Henderson

Piedra
08-16-2003, 05:02 PM
Wanderlei Silva lost against Belfort I wont argue about that but against Tito it was a very closed decision, so its just a matter of time until he proves he is the best.

realkaps
08-16-2003, 10:53 PM
I was just saying those where the last top ten guys he fought......

lightweight
08-16-2003, 11:37 PM
Originally posted by Creed
Saying Mike Van Arsdale was a top opponet is a joke. The best people he has beaten are Sakuraba and Dan Henderson

Well, you gotta think back five years. Nowadays Arsdale is no way top ten, but five years ago he was dominant, and like I said, considered the best NHB fighter on the scene. In that era he would have been considered in the top. And, he outweighed Silva by at LEAST 10 lbs, probably closer to 15-20, everyone said Silva couldn't beat him.

BDWHOAWHOA
08-20-2003, 05:49 PM
Sorry bro... but van Arsdale was NEVER "King of NHB" ... He barely had 4 fights on his record when he fought Silva. And three of those were in a tourney in the same night. And those guys had only one or two fights on their record.

No... the guys that ruled in those days were; Vitor, Pele, Frank, Bas, Henderson... and if you think about it... they didn't even have wieght classes so you would also have to factor in Igor, Kerr, Coleman etc...

Sorry dude... but Mike don't make the cut on this list.

And BTW... Silva is the ****... he'll fight whoever they put in front of him... so it's not his fault if he fights a tomato can in the first round, that's on DSE.... he got my respect when he stood up with Cro-Cop when he really didn't have to... and for taking that god-awful liver kick without even flinching... he's tha ****in man.

Bluecifer
08-20-2003, 06:33 PM
I also think that if arona fought Silva, it would look just like Tito vs. Silva. Silva would get smothered and lose the decision. Silva is fun to watch, but has a suspect chin and is a bit over rated IMO. Like I said, the real GP champ will be whoever wins between Liddell and Jackson.

lightweight
08-20-2003, 07:51 PM
I'm probably fighting too hard for Arsdale, but here's a quote from fightsport.

"After this win, Van Arsdale went on to win in two UFC events and was recognized as one of the best vale tudo fighters in the world--that is, until he faced Wanderlei Silva in IVC 6 and was knocked out."

Top ten or not he was a damn good fighter. Had he been content to gnp he most likely would have won, he was too confident in his stand up though and it cost him a lot. I will still consider this a good win for Silva though, Arsdale was a real threat.

BDWHOAWHOA
08-20-2003, 08:13 PM
AGREED...