What do you think guys?

Personally I quite liked him, if there had been weapons of mass destruction we may be calling him the greatest Prime Minister of all time, the problem is there wasn't any!

I like Tony Blair, when he's gone people will realise he wasn't all that bad. Iraq will unfortunatly overshadow what good he has done for the country such as improvement in the countries economy

An arrogant pompous Eliteist Posh Communist disguised as a Liberal..
Power went to his head.. and all he cares about is his legacy
He refused to listen to the Majority and continuously forced his OWN and His cunt of a wive's personal morality on people who didn't want it..
To sum it all up...
He said the Voting Public was to stupid to understand the complexties of constitutional matters...and therefore they should have no say in deciding the future of their nation...

He could Only come to THAT conclusion.. (thinking people are stupid) Because His lying spinsters were so good AT fooling y'all WHEN THE TRUTH was SLAPPING you repeatedly across the face... That you must have absolutley no mind of your own..

anyways the man was nothing but smoke and mirrors..
Your country reminds me of The USSR in so many ways..
The propoganda is rampant.. the corruption is rampant..And common sense left the buliding years ago...

An arrogant pompous Eliteist Posh Communist disguised as a Liberal..
Power went to his head.. and all he cares about is his legacy
He refused to listen to the Majority and continuously forced his OWN and His cunt of a wive's personal morality on people who didn't want it..
To sum it all up...
He said the Voting Public was to stupid to understand the complexties of constitutional matters...and therefore they should have no say in deciding the future of their nation...

He could Only come to THAT conclusion.. (thinking people are stupid) Because His lying spinsters were so good AT fooling y'all WHEN THE TRUTH was SLAPPING you repeatedly across the face... That you must have absolutley no mind of your own..

anyways the man was nothing but smoke and mirrors..
Your country reminds me of The USSR in so many ways..
The propoganda is rampant.. the corruption is rampant..And common sense left the buliding years ago...


yours too now man.

An arrogant pompous Eliteist Posh Communist disguised as a Liberal..
Power went to his head.. and all he cares about is his legacy
He refused to listen to the Majority and continuously forced his OWN and His cunt of a wive's personal morality on people who didn't want it..
To sum it all up...
He said the Voting Public was to stupid to understand the complexties of constitutional matters...and therefore they should have no say in deciding the future of their nation...

He could Only come to THAT conclusion.. (thinking people are stupid) Because His lying spinsters were so good AT fooling y'all WHEN THE TRUTH was SLAPPING you repeatedly across the face... That you must have absolutley no mind of your own..

anyways the man was nothing but smoke and mirrors..
Your country reminds me of The USSR in so many ways..
The propoganda is rampant.. the corruption is rampant..And common sense left the buliding years ago...

OK!

Welt, how long have you lived over here mate?

I only ask because I wonder if you can remember Britain under Thatcher and Major?

I agree with some of your points and cannot condone the handling of Iraq but....I remember the strikes of the eighties, the widespread poverty, the lack of health care, a shattered economy and bleak outlook.

Now Blair and the labour government have made mistakes I accept that and some of it angers me but show me a government who can prove that they haven't made mistakes and I will say they have the greatest spin doctors.

Blair without the spin can at least prove that he has made huge improvements to the economy, if the economy is good then the country benefits in many aspects.

Britain now has the lowest inflation for thirty years.
People in work is at a record level, up by over 2 million since 1997.
Hospital waiting lists in England are at their lowest since 1987.
In the NHS there are 19,300 more doctors and over 77,500 more nurses than ever before.
More teachers are in our schools than at any point in last 20 years - 28,500 more than in 1997.
Police numbers are at record levels - up over 12,500 since 1997.

I have lived through 7 Prime Ministers and as far as I am concerned he has been the best.

That's not to say that he hasn't made some big mistakes but as I said before he has more to deal with than most of the rest!

He sucked... Iraq alone is enough to outlaw any legacy he wished to achieve.

OK!

Welt, how long have you lived over here mate?

I only ask because I wonder if you can remember Britain under Thatcher and Major?
I agree with some of your points and cannot condone the handling of Iraq but....I remember the strikes of the eighties, the widespread poverty, the lack of health care, a shattered economy and bleak outlook.

Now Blair and the labour government have made mistakes I accept that and some of it angers me but show me a government who can prove that they haven't made mistakes and I will say they have the greatest spin doctors.

Blair without the spin can at least prove that he has made huge improvements to the economy, if the economy is good then the country benefits in many aspects.
Britain now has the lowest inflation for thirty years.
People in work is at a record level, up by over 2 million since 1997.
Hospital waiting lists in England are at their lowest since 1987.
In the NHS there are 19,300 more doctors and over 77,500 more nurses than ever before.
More teachers are in our schools than at any point in last 20 years - 28,500 more than in 1997.
Police numbers are at record levels - up over 12,500 since 1997.

I have lived through 7 Prime Ministers and as far as I am concerned he has been the best.

That's not to say that he hasn't made some big mistakes but as I said before he has more to deal with than most of the rest!

No I did not live In the UK during the Thatcher and Major years.. But I did Live at those times.. I call them The Reagan Bush SR years.. And It was NOT just the UK.. The whole world was changing and everything good TODAY?.. the foundations were built during the 80's and early 90's during very tough times..

The POUND has Always been strong on the World Market.. The reason for the BOOST in the UK economy comes from Blairs one GOOD decision.. NOT to Adopt the EURO... The UK economy didnt so much GROW as the rest of Europe's fell.. You cant Take an economy like Germany's..Tie it to Polands.. and not expect it to drag the more powerful economies down..
As a result.. If 1 Pound is worth 2 Euros... where are you going to do Business..??? If I can turn every pound I make Into 2 Euros.. And I am based in A Euro Country.. Then I love Pounds..

Under Blair..The country has become PC nightmare..
Where the good honest Hardworking people have no rights except to pay taxes..
Where the Police publicy declare they will no longer respond to commerical thefts under £100.. but will send 3 cars to stop Children for playing Football in the streets..
Where My 12 year old boy is still reading at the "see spot run level" (I was reading 500 page novels by the time I was 12)
Where discipline and respect have gone the way of the DO DO bird..
Where failures are called deferrred sucesses.. and the standards lowered so as to boost the success levels(smoke and Mirrors)
Where the BAD guys are the Victims and The real Victims are just poor Unfortunate souls.. who need to get over whatever crime was commited against them because.. well their attacker grew up Poor..

The UK is a country controlled By Special interest..

No I did not live In the UK during the Thatcher and Major years.. But I did Live at those times.. I call them The Reagan Bush SR years.. And It was NOT just the UK.. The whole world was changing and everything good TODAY?.. the foundations were built during the 80's and early 90's during very tough times..

The POUND has Always been strong on the World Market.. The reason for the BOOST in the UK economy comes from Blairs one GOOD decision.. NOT to Adopt the EURO... The UK economy didnt so much GROW as the rest of Europe's fell.. You cant Take an economy like Germany's..Tie it to Polands.. and not expect it to drag the more powerful economies down..
As a result.. If 1 Pound is worth 2 Euros... where are you going to do Business..??? If I can turn every pound I make Into 2 Euros.. And I am based in A Euro Country.. Then I love Pounds..

Under Blair..The country has become PC nightmare..
Where the good honest Hardworking people have no rights except to pay taxes..
Where the Police publicy declare they will no longer respond to commerical thefts under £100.. but will send 3 cars to stop Children for playing Football in the streets..
Where My 12 year old boy is still reading at the "see spot run level" (I was reading 500 page novels by the time I was 12)
Where discipline and respect have gone the way of the DO DO bird..
Where failures are called deferrred sucesses.. and the standards lowered so as to boost the success levels(smoke and Mirrors)
Where the BAD guys are the Victims and The real Victims are just poor Unfortunate souls.. who need to get over whatever crime was commited against them because.. well their attacker grew up Poor..

The UK is a country controlled By Special interest..

Why all the shouting lol?

Again I agree with many of your comments, but, I do remember living here during those times and the country was far worse believe me!

As for education, I cannot agree with you, I too have a 12 year old and he does read novels, in fact he has been reading large books i.e. the Harry Potter novels for about 5 years, my other two older kids although being moved around the country with me have attained a strong education, I think its down to the schools the children attend, I have had no problems on that score (I am talking about schools in Merseyside, Newcastle, Surrey and Salisbury) I am not jumping on the bandwagon and referring to statements made about success rate etc I am basing this purely on my personal experiences.

You mention the strength of the pound and use it to almost prove your point against the success of the Blair economy, but you fail to mention that this government is the first and only government to address the debt we owe to the States (From both World Wars), they have also been in a position to write off bilateral debts from the likes of countries like Tanzania and have been the first country from the G8 to do so.
You also cannot tie together the political failure of other countries i.e Germany and the Eastern block etc and say that's why Britain has prospered because poor management doesn't lead to success at any level and Britain must have managed well whilst many of our European neighbours didn't!
And most importantly the average British person is better off than they were 20 years ago!
Where I do agree with you is on the PC front however once one minority is correctly protected by legislation then the doors open for all other minority's and the appending issues. Unfortunately its all or nothing otherwise the government would have been seen as offering prejudice!
Also much of the new legislation was brought in to protect the likes of immigrants etc, who as much I don't like it are a huge part of why our economy has soared!

BTW Isn't Politics one of things we shouldn't discuss? Lol!

Why all the shouting lol?

Again I agree with many of your comments, but, I do remember living here during those times and the country was far worse believe me!

As for education, I cannot agree with you, I too have a 12 year old and he does read novels, in fact he has been reading large books i.e. the Harry Potter novels for about 5 years, my other two older kids although being moved around the country with me have attained a strong education, I think its down to the schools the children attend, I have had no problems on that score (I am talking about schools in Merseyside, Newcastle, Surrey and Salisbury) I am not jumping on the bandwagon and referring to statements made about success rate etc I am basing this purely on my personal experiences.

You mention the strength of the pound and use it to almost prove your point against the success of the Blair economy, but you fail to mention that this government is the first and only government to address the debt we owe to the States (From both World Wars), they have also been in a position to write off bilateral debts from the likes of countries like Tanzania and have been the first country from the G8 to do so.
You also cannot tie together the political failure of other countries i.e Germany and the Eastern block etc and say that's why Britain has prospered because poor management doesn't lead to success at any level and Britain must have managed well whilst many of our European neighbours didn't!
And most importantly the average British person is better off than they were 20 years ago!
Where I do agree with you is on the PC front however once one minority is correctly protected by legislation then the doors open for all other minority's and the appending issues. Unfortunately its all or nothing otherwise the government would have been seen as offering prejudice!
Also much of the new legislation was brought in to protect the likes of immigrants etc, who as much I don't like it are a huge part of why our economy has soared!

BTW Isn't Politics one of things we shouldn't discuss? Lol!

I am Not shouting.. LOL And I have much respect for you Sir..
Also I agree that it is Good The WWII debts were paid off I was often a little perturbed as to why The UK still owed 100's of Millions to Canada and had still not paid it off.. And was quite pelased to see the final Payment made last year ..:fing02:

Youa re also correct that my childs school seems to be the problem and maybe not the whole edcucation system.
My childs school is all about PC and making sure he understands Sihkisim but not if he can read..

I will also agree That I am in no hurry to return to Canada based almost soley on my financial postion in this Country compared to back Home..

I am not saying Blair's government or even the Labour party are ****e.. My feelings for Blair are quite personal..
And maybe because of that.. I foucus almost only the Bad..

I am Not shouting.. LOL And I have much respect for you Sir..
Also I agree that it is Good The WWII debts were paid off I was often a little perturbed as to why The UK still owed 100's of Millions to Canada and had still not paid it off.. And was quite pelased to see the final Payment made last year ..:fing02:

Youa re also correct that my childs school seems to be the problem and maybe not the whole edcucation system.
My childs school is all about PC and making sure he understands Sihkisim but not if he can read..

I will also agree That I am in no hurry to return to Canada based almost soley on my financial postion in this Country compared to back Home..

I am not saying Blair's government or even the Labour party are ****e.. My feelings for Blair are quite personal..
And maybe because of that.. I foucus almost only the Bad..

That worries me mate, I'm all for a multi cultural country if those wanting to come here are willing to integrate with our culture but I cannot abide other cultures being forced onto the children, especially if it compromises their overall education.

BTW I'm glad Canada has been paid finally, I never understood it myself, we paid millions to aid other countries yet still had huge debts to pay elsewhere???

I like Blair, he went about most things in the correct way, I don't blame him for the situation in Iraq because I supported the Invasion and removal of Saddam, its easy with hindsight to now say it was a bad move but don't forget 9/11 and the subsequent attacks!

Blair= Bush's arse licker.........

I remember too well the Thatcher Years.

for all his faults hes been a Great Prime Minister.

Will anyone actually vote for Cameron?????

I remember too well the Thatcher Years.

for all his faults hes been a Great Prime Minister.

Will anyone actually vote for Cameron?????

Not me mate, I would rather have Blair for another 10 years than Cameron, saying that I'm not sure about Brown either, watch him when he smiles, his face smiles but not his eyes!

I fear that we will be wishing Tony was back in, in a couple of years!

he invaded iraq, killed thousands of people and made the region unstable for the next 100 years.

he has filled england with so many people that housing prices have shot up, too many cars on the road.

He ****ed the health service up even more.

He is responsible for all terrorist activity in the UK....

What is there to like about him? Personally I can`t stand the bastard, i hope some cunt does a Kennedy on him and relieves him of half his head.

It would be "morally" justified.

What do you think guys?

Personally I quite liked him, if there had been weapons of mass destruction we may be calling him the greatest Prime Minister of all time, the problem is there wasn't any!


he did well at home but for me it is all ruined by Iraq.:cool:

I think he has done an ok job, they invested extra money into the public services which was good, but sadly the origination of some of the public sector hasn't worked that well, although you cant blame him for all of that. the one thing that pisses me of is people that constantly moan about the prim minister then when a new one gets in they love em then about 3-4 years latter they start hating on them, it has happened to every prime minster. even Churchill a bit. people are never happy there will always be people hating on them. as for the new party leaders to be honest i don't like any of them, i cant stand Cameron he is a copy of blair and will say anything to get into power, brown was imo a bad chancellor, and ming campbell of the lib dems leads a bunch of gay rent boy hiring fools

hes ok just need to sort out imagration a stupid poltical corectnes

I firmly believed that new labour was for me, but after some really good reforms tro education and health, the last few years have been really disappointing. That said, since 1979 we haven't had a bad government, Thatcher made some amazing reforms that get lost in all the Poll tax/miners whinging nonsense, Major actually continued that including the job-seekers allowance, a great policy admired all over the world.

I'm a market socialist if that makes sense, and I'm cautiously optimistic that Brown will be another good PM, if not as slick as Blair. I don't see anything in Cameron that tells me he has the intellect to be my PM - I like a man with intelligence - but I think theres a 75% chance he will win the next election.

Overall 1979-2007 have been very successful years for the limey nation. We need to continue that over the next 30 years and catch up with the US productivity whilst leading the way in the environment and poverty alleviation in Africa, something Blair has started but not finished.

Brown was a bad chancellor - please explain - I've never actually heard anyone say that before....

Do you remember the 1970s?? or even 1992 for that matter? Do you remember interest rates of 15% in the comparatively successful 1980s?

I think his role is overstated but it is he who has ploughed more money into public services whilst keeping tax rates roughly steady and overseeing 10 years of consistent growth, something that has NEVER happened in the UK's history.

Brown was a bad chancellor - please explain - I've never actually heard anyone say that before....

Do you remember the 1970s?? or even 1992 for that matter? Do you remember interest rates of 15% in the comparatively successful 1980s?

I think his role is overstated but it is he who has ploughed more money into public services whilst keeping tax rates roughly steady and overseeing 10 years of consistent growth, something that has NEVER happened in the UK's history.

Agreed - Brown is/was the greatest Chancellor of modern times, the one thing the Blair government cannot be faulted on is the state of the economy.
Brown was instrumental in that success.

The Iraq war has pretty much screwed-up Blair's legacy as Prime Minister so for that fact alone Bush's ''bum boy'' has to be the choice here. Saying he did ok under the circumstances is brushing the Iraq war under the carpet IMO.

D'you reckon Paul? I think voting bum boy brushes the rest of the past ten years under the carpet rather than the other way round.

Am I alone in thinking that the importance of the Iraq war is blown out of all proportion? I mean its a mistake that will be a large part of Blair's legacy, but I don't think it is actually that important to the future of this country.

D'you reckon Paul? I think voting bum boy brushes the rest of the past ten years under the carpet rather than the other way round.

Am I alone in thinking that the importance of the Iraq war is blown out of all proportion? I mean its a mistake that will be a large part of Blair's legacy, but I don't think it is actually that important to the future of this country.

I don't think the importance of the Iraq is blown out of proportion as it has turned into a complete shambles but its easy looking at and making judgements now we have the hindsight to do so. I took part GW1 and was fully behind the coalitions decision to invade Iraq and depose Saddam because he was a evil tyrant and I did believe that they had weapons of mass destruction.
Now with hindsight its easy to judge, there were no WMD's, Saddam probably was no worse than dictators like Idi Amin etc and we did nothing to stop him and others, and Iraq has become an unwinnable police action.
However I am still of the opinion that the invasion was done for the right reasons, some time things just don't go to plan!

Therefore to tar the reputation of the man who has brought peace to Northern Ireland (once thought impossible), started the ball rolling in ending bi-lateral world debt, stabilized a shaking economy and left the country in far better state then when he found it solely on the outcome of an well intentioned if not misguided action in the Middle East is simply not fair!

Fully agree Micky - so you're effectively saying Iraq has been overplayed by Blair's detractors.....

I do think that the UK was heading in the right direction before 1997 though. I have to write speeches every day that harp on about change since 1997, but in truth once the ERM crisis had played out, we started to perform pretty well. I'd say 1994-5 was the point at which we became a gold-star country in economics terms, not when New Labour came to power.

Brown was a bad chancellor - please explain - I've never actually heard anyone say that before....

Do you remember the 1970s?? or even 1992 for that matter? Do you remember interest rates of 15% in the comparatively successful 1980s?

I think his role is overstated but it is he who has ploughed more money into public services whilst keeping tax rates roughly steady and overseeing 10 years of consistent growth, something that has NEVER happened in the UK's history.

the main reason i say this is because of the pension raid in the first few years of the labour goverment, but the way that most of the new public sector funding for building's will completely bankrupt the country in about 30 years, the PFI scheme is the worst thing possible. i was watching a program that said that most of the PFI schemes are more expensive than goverment schemes. i think the program said we will have billions of debt to the pfi owners, taken this from wiki.
As against that, however, there have been a number of high-profile PFI failures, many of which have been exposed by Private Eye, a British satirical magazine. For example, a government report leaked on 17 June 2005 said that a new privately financed hospital in Leeds had "breached every section of the fire safety code".[3] The Skye Bridge PFI scheme infamously cost the public £93m (and required the closure of the existing ferry to prevent competition), although it should have cost only £15m to build. Equally, the fact that major risks can be effectively transferred has been demonstrated in a number of cases, most notably the National Physical Laboratory; this deal ultimately caused the collapse of the building contractor when the cost of building a complex scientific laboratory was very much larger than estimated. The laboratory was ultimately built, but the cost of doing so caused the winding up of Laser, a joint venture between Serco Group and John Laing [4].

Furthermore, the scale of PFI projects in the health & education sectors since 1997 is now having a serious impact on public service budgets. Because the projects are more expensive in the private sector (on average 30% more than if the Government borrowed the money and did the work in the public sector) the payments to the private owners of the PFI schemes are stretching already constricted budgets. Many Health Trusts are in serious difficulty already, and when the level of spending falls in 2007, some may become insolvent. The Government is already in negotiation with private healthcare providers to come in and run 'failing' Trusts.

Additional controversy is caused by the off-balance sheet nature of PFI contracts. Under UK accounting, the PFI company does not enjoy the risks and rewards of the building - the government carries demand risk, for example - so the building is not shown on its balance sheet. Instead its main asset is the finance debtor - the long term contractual obligation of the government to pay for the building. For the government accounting, the fact that it pays a single charge (the 'Unitary Charge') for both the building and its maintenance is sufficient for it to be classed as a revenue item, so neither the building or the long-term obligation to pay appear of the government's balance sheet. Were the total PFI liability shown on the UK balance sheet - as would be required under UK accounting standards - the government's finance would look somewhat different.